The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kramer

The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kramer

Postby Debrina Woods on Sat Apr 14, 2012 12:00 am

I am the granddaughter of Helen Lorraine Kramer who was told that she was actually Helen Lorraine Allison and who was listed as a victum of the Titanic disaster. She was the Daughter of Hudson J. & Bess Allison, first class passengers and who are known to have both perished with the sinking. This is a mystery that has had much speculation and is a story that I grew up with from my earliest memory.

Bottomline...all anyone need do is see a photo of Hudson Allison and my grandmother and if there was ever a father and daughter it is they. I have the photos I have letters I have her daughter Adele, my mother with me to interview and am seeking to tell and share this tale in it's truth and it's entirety once and for all.

Please anyone interetsed in assisiting me, or learning more...feel free to contact me.
Thank you.
Debrina Woods
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby Karina Fox on Sat Apr 14, 2012 12:59 pm

Hello Debrina,

I have been researching the Allison family for over ten years now and my husband and I are currently writing a book about our research. We are planning to have a chapter dedicated to the Allison/Kramer story.

I have been trying for years to get in touch with members of Helen Kramer's family but to no avail. I am very interested in seeing any pictures you have of your grandmother and anything else you wouldn't mind sharing.

If you could email me at: bessieallison@gmail.com I would really appreciate it. I would be happy to share with you what I have so far.

Kind Regards,
Karina Fox
Writing a book about the Allison family
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby Timothy Trower on Mon Apr 16, 2012 12:15 am

Debrina,

As a long-time student of the disaster, I've often wondered what became of Helen Lorraine Kramer; in short, I would love to see what information that you have regarding your grandmother. This forum is the perfect place to discuss this matter (although I am comfortable doing so off list as well) and hope that you are able to find answers to this century-old question.

I may be contacted by email at timtrower@NOSPAMtitanichistoricalsociety.net (just remove the NOSPAM from the eddress before sending.
All the best,

Tim

THSMB Admin -- timtrower@NOSPAMtitanichistoricalsociety.net (just remove the NOSPAM before sending an email).
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby Thomas Golembiewski on Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:44 pm

This is for everybody's reference:

Chicago Tribune, September 5, 1940, p. 18:

CHILD FEARED LOST ON TITANIC REPORTED LIVING IN MICHIGAN

Montreal, Que., Sept. 4 (AP)—A Montreal family was stirred today by the prospect that Lorraine Allison, long believed to have been drowned in the Titanic disaster of 1912, still is alive and residing in Berkley, Mich., as Mrs. Laurence Kramer.

The family is that of Mrs. G. B. Allison, sister-in-law of Hudson J. C. Allison, Montreal financier, who was drowned with his wife when the titanic went down 28 years ago. Also presumed to have been lost was Lorraine, the Allisons’ 3 year old daughter. After the sinking Allison’s body was recovered, but those of his wife and child never were found.

Today it was learned Mrs. Kramer had written to the United States department of justice c claiming to be Lorraine.

_____________________________

This story's been bouncing around for decades---amazing nobody did research in this area. It would be an easy task to hide a young child within the folds of a long skirt (such as the women wore in 1912---or even underneath!) . . . Poor Lorraine . . . You'd think somebody would've researched the papers in Michigan and Quebec . . . .
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby Debrina Woods on Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:08 am

Thank You For your open mindedness and support as concerns this...and I assure you I have all the documentation required to bring this story back to light. Mrs G.B. Allsion, the Widow of Hudson's brother George and his brother Percy were the only two that denied her. (of course everything they had and there was quite a substacial fortune involved belonged to Loraine) It was NEVER about the money though, my grandmother just wanted a family and to know her true identity.

It is my true desire to finally prove her claim utilizing by any means possible (DNA etc) and then to be able to one day place her ashes in the empty grave site in Canada, with her name and reunite her with her Father and Brother Trevor who are also buired there and bring peace and final rest to this wonferful young family who was left with such a sorrow filled legacy.

While these circumstances did break her heart...they did not break her spirit ...she was a wonderful woman, who raised 5 children of her own and left us all, the finest legacy of all...that WE were loved and that WE were a family. The one thing she had been so woefully been denied herself as a child.

I am currently compiling all the mountain of documenation I have which has been stored in a suitcase for over 70 years. I have all the attorneys correspodences documenting his progress to her and many, many letters from the mothers side and fathers side of the family that accepted her claim and who were appalled at Percy & Georges widow's behavior.

And this is just part of the story, there were at least two very suspicious deaths that we know of (the atty among them, at the height of the inquiriy and whose office was then burned days after his death and crucial information destroyed) as well as the young brothers untimely death at 18, just as he was due to inheirit and there could be more...

Yes, it is a heartbreaking story that happens to also be about my family and that I grew up with all my life. Wish me success in accomplishing the return of Helen Loriane to her father & brother after a 100 year separation and finally bringing this last true Titanic mystery to conclusion.
Thanks be to all who support me in this endeavor.
Debrina Woods
 
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby Timothy Trower on Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:15 am

It should be very interesting indeed to see this finally brought to its logical conclusion. I will assume that you know where relatives are living for the purposes of DNA testing; as with Sidney Goodwin, proper DNA testing was finally able to identify him as the "unknown child."
All the best,

Tim

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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby Thomas Golembiewski on Wed Apr 18, 2012 5:21 pm

What's stunning is that this wasn't looked into more deeply decades ago---this story has been out there since 1940! Poor Lorraine . . . And why hasn't someone gone deeper into Michigan and Quebec newspapers for more details of this, or whatever was reported? Let's hope this can all be clarified soon . . .
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby David Smith on Tue Apr 24, 2012 6:17 pm

Debrina Woods wrote:Please anyone interetsed in assisiting me, or learning more...feel free to contact me.
Thank you.
Debrina Woods

Hi Debrina, There was an article in the Toronto Globe and Mail, Saturday April,14th 2012 Page A9 showing a picture of a new baby Hudson. I believe Hudson from the Titanic would be his Great, Great, Great Uncle. Not sure if DNA can go that far back. The photo shows "Heather Graham, Heather's father Charles Graham and baby son Hudson Lansdell in Chesterville Ontario." Hudson from the Titanic would be Charles Great Uncle. (I think) Let us know how your research is going.
Dave
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby Debrina Woods on Wed Apr 25, 2012 3:19 pm

Thank you David for posting,
FYI: Hudson "Trevor" Allison was in actuality the infant (11mos) son of Hudson J. Allison who perished with his wife Bess the night of the disaster and would indeed, be my great-uncle but, sadly he died at 18 years old, just before he was to inherit the Allison forutne...

This would have been 11 years before my grandmother was informed of her true identity etc. in 1940.
The events of Trevors death were and remain a huge source of pain and concern for the few of us now and in the letters from family members at the time, that I have here. I have recently been informed though, that there is a diary Trevor wrote and that I hope to be able to read very soon.

We are hoping to complete DNA testing before too much longer and then be quite diligent in bringing this tragic tale out and into the public domaine. Again, I am not a third party who has unearthed this information but an actual family member for whom this is a very personal journey.

NOTE: I am available to travel and lecture and present a powerpoint presentation as regrads this claim/story compiled from all the documentation recently discovered, to groups who have interest.
contact me: dwmgr@aol.com
Debrina Woods
 
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby Thomas Golembiewski on Wed Apr 25, 2012 4:57 pm

Debrina:

Thanks so very much for bringing all this out, and sharing it with everyone . . . I believe all want a satisfying ending to this long drawn-out situation . . .
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby Jill Carlier on Wed Apr 25, 2012 5:12 pm

Im hanging on the edge of my seat to see how all of this came about and how it will come to a conclusion! very exciting!
Jill Carlier/Rochester, Ny
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby David Smith on Wed Apr 25, 2012 10:58 pm

Debrina,
I'm sure you have this information, but this is copied from
http://www.enotes.com/topic/Helen_Loraine_Allison

"The bodies of Hudson and George were recovered by the Mackay-Bennett, a ship dispatched to sea after the sinking for the purpose of locating as many of the dead as possible. The bodies of Bess and Loraine were never recovered.

In 1940, in a scenario very similar to Anna Anderson (who claimed to be the Grand Duchess Anastasia Nikolaevna) a woman named Loraine Kramer claimed to be Loraine Allison, having survived when her parents gave her up in the final moments of the sinking to a passenger in a lifeboat. In a bizarre twist, Kramer stated that on the rescue ship Carpathia, she shared a room with none other than Thomas Andrews, the designer of the Titanic who himself had perished in the sinking. She further stated that the director of the White Star Line, J. Bruce Ismay (who was later severely criticized for serious structural problems on the ship as a means of cost efficiency, ordering Captain E.J. Smith to pick up speed in icy waters, and then entering into a lifeboat when so many others died) and the brother of Hudson Allison together with his wife (both of whom stood to gain financially as the caretakers of baby Trevor) persuaded Andrews to go into hiding along with Loraine by offering him periodic bribery payments as a means to buy his silence. The two resided in the American midwest, though why Kramer chose to wait until she was in her early thirties to issue this revelation was unclear. A further cloak of mystery emerged when Kramer did manage to cite a few facts known only to the Allison family and their household, and this was explained by the allegation that some contact had taken place at some time between Kramer and Alice Cleaver. When interviewed, however, Cleaver assured officials that Loraine most certainly did not survive the disaster, though she never denied having engaged in any conversation with Kramer. When asked of the whereabouts of Thomas Andrews, the man who "raised" her following the deaths of her parents, Kramer responded that his own recent death had inspired her to go public with her story.

The events came to a head when the lawyer representing Kramer died in the midst of the proceedings, and when asked about the earth shattering evidence (such as letters from Ismay) that he had been ready to produce, Kramer said that these papers had been lost just recently in a fire. Again, why they were not produced as soon as she went public with her story remains unclear, but this final episode all but sealed her chances of being taken seriously. She reportedly moved to the west coast of the United States, and was never heard from again. To add to the cloak and dagger scenario, Trevor himself had died from ptomaine poisoning in 1929 at the age of eighteen,so when Kramer released her story eleven years later, it was the brother of Hudson Allison and his own family who had reaped the financial benefits of the estate."

Dave
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby John Knight on Thu Apr 26, 2012 11:48 pm

Hello Debrina,
this is indeed a very serious proposition that you have resurrected. It must be treated with great care of course.

I have a few opening questions that I hope you can answer for me?

When did your grandmother pass away?

What does your mother say about all this?

When did your grandmother marry Lawrence Kramer?

Who rescued your grandmother from the Titanic?

Are you planning to charge for your 'lectures'?

Kind regards,
John.
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby Debrina Woods on Sat Apr 28, 2012 1:30 pm

To EVERYONE who has been in recent contact as regards this story.....I want it understood that I am not a third party who is researching this tragic tale for sensational purposes but, that it is my FAMILY story and a very personal and emotional journey. One that as soon as the DNA evidence is completed next month will hopefully prove that my mother and I are Hudson's direct descendents (Grand-daughter and great-granddaughter respectively) and ALL that, that will imply.

I am also not alone in seeking justice and truth in this matter. Bess Allison's sisters' descendents are in support as are others from the family with the eventual end hopefully commulating in the reunion of her ashes to her grave site which has laid empty lo these 100 years and also to return her to her Father & Brother laid to rest there. THAT is my mother's and my motivation.

That quest being accomplished this summer in peace and respect....
I do, once established as a legitimate descendant, will in fact intend to go about righting this huge injustice in honor and respect to both my deceased great grandfather and my grandmother in response to all that denied her (in some cases with such vehemence) and all that befell his two adored children.

I witnessed her sorrow and tears over these events....and yet saw how she overcame with grace, dignity and LOVE the adversity of her circumstance. She was a lifelong inspiration to me, even if she would have had NOTHING to do with the Titanic disaster...but I owe it to her and to Hudson & Bess to TRY "without prejudice" to simply bring the truth finally to light.

Again what is NOT mentioned in the public domain (and let me state this definitively as I have the proof in their letters) is that the "ALLISON's" did NOT reject her... she was accepted and supported by her mothers sister, her fathers uncle, numerous Allison cousins, business associates of Hud's, friends who went to school with both the mother and father and MORE. The ONLY TWO who denied her were his youngest brother and his other brothers widow BOTH OF WHOM BENEFITED DIRECTLY from the inheritances. (both Hudson's and her brother,Trevor's)

To Answer:
While I have retained legal consul as regards discussion of this highly personal matter, I will assist in providing some details in this forum:

1. Granny passed away peacefully among family in the early 80's

2. My Mother who is 82 is excited to participate in what could be her definitive gift to her mother, to place her remains in peace at last with the family that so many others sought to deny her.

3. I have granny's marriage licence that details the information requested but consider that personal and it will be revealed in the months and years ahead for all to review.

4. Granny assumed all her life that her father was a man named James Hyde information that HE DISCLOSES to be untrue and that HE is not her father when granny routinely requested a copy of her birth certificate but that Hudson & Bess Allsion (who he had met onboard )were. And so this story began in early fall 1940. Through all that we have discovered we believe James Hyde was an alias to protect someone while not a bad man, was perhaps a victim of cruel and unusual circumstance, forcing him to behave against what is considered better nature.

5. Yes, I will, once all the last wee bits of information are acquired (i.e. collecting my grandmothers letters to the principle and misc. parties involved, Trevor's Diary etc. as I have all theirs to her) plan to present all documentation and this family's journey, in a book...and as I have incurred significant costs in obtaining the DNA collection and analysis, legal consultation, researching and travel related to all, I do plan to charge a fee for sharing my information to public forums to recoup and will soon be handled by a booking agency. As for now I am dealing directly with inquiries and have 11 purposed so far for this summer.

But to reiterate, while I will undoubtedly benefit from book/tour etc IT IS NOT MY sole motivation. I NEVER expected there to be such public interest albeit controversy and I have information that has heretofore been unavailable to the public domain...that is until now. I want as many interested persons as possible to make this journey with me to uncover what is certainly one of The Titanic's LAST MYSTERIES and to experience the TRUTH and as mentioned (without prejudice) ALL that it may imply.
Debrina Woods
 
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby John Knight on Sat Apr 28, 2012 6:42 pm

Hiya Debrina,
thanks for your response. Perhaps you can answer a few more questions for me. I am deeply interested in this subject and wish to help clear everything up.

I have proof that a Helen Loraine Kramer, the only one I can find, passed away in 1992. Is this your grandmother?

I am pleased to note that your mother is eager to participate. Could you tell me what her surname is? Is it Woods? Or is it another name you can tell me?

I hope you do not mind me asking these questions and wish you to know that I am just as eager as yourself for justice to be done.

Regards,
John.
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby Debrina Woods on Sat Apr 28, 2012 9:31 pm

Yes, perhaps it was in the early 90's in Sacremento. I confused my decades. Sadly, I was out of the country but her children James (Jim) and my mother (adele) were there. Her ashes are with us and have been all these years. You can contact me directly for my mothers suranme and photos.

Once the DNA testing report is returned next month it is pretty much the end of the controversy and then we will proceed in revealing ALL else as regards this tragic story and what is else is disclosed within the documentation that has been organized into 12 binders after discovery of all in the suitcase and which will be made public soon after.
Debrina Woods
 
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby Debrina Woods on Sat Apr 28, 2012 9:58 pm

Note: anyone with further serious interest is invited to contact me for photos and a summary. All the original binders are in a depository now for safe keeping with my legal team but I have made copies of them that we are working from with the professional and legal researchers currently involved in substanciating this claim.

As mentioned before, in a month all the controvery should be over with the DNA results and then the truth will finally be revealed to all... at least as pertains to my grandmother.

Then, after she is finally laid to rest, we plan to proceed on to further discovery (from leads and documents from the ATTY (Mr. Flynn), in the binders establishing) as to the TRUE Identity of Jame Hyde and hope the whole of the worldwide historical community both professional and private will assist us in that quest as well.

PS IF it is out there, then yes, I have seen "everything" in print as pertains to my grandmothers claim but, understand that people only had the information at hand and as she refused to disuccuss this matter, naturaly, assumptions (wrong) were made. The documents I have explain many, many details that have led to misguided doubt all these years.
Debrina Woods
 
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby John Knight on Sat Apr 28, 2012 11:42 pm

"You can contact me directly for my mothers suranme and photos."
Thank you that is very kind. My e-mail address is below. It would be excellent if you could forward me those things.
johnknight635@yahoo.co.uk

Very best wishes,
John.
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby Debrina Woods on Sun Apr 29, 2012 12:01 am

To Dave Smith...
Sorry for delay in answering you, yes you are correct Margaret Graham was Hudsons older sister and the Grahams you saw in the photograph are her decendents from Chesterville whom I hope to be in touch with very soon in fact. NOTE: I have been in touch with the Toronto paper and have requested a copy of that issue. Thank you. dw
Debrina Woods
 
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Re: The Mystery: Helen Lorraine Allison & Helen Lorraine Kra

Postby Debrina Woods on Sun Apr 29, 2012 4:39 pm

ATTENTION: To better assist all who have expressed interest in my grandmothers story, and to begin to release some of the SUPPORT documentation that was recently discovered...I would like to invite you to visit my new web site:

http://www.titanicslastmystery.com
(Titanics Last Mystery)

For access to information heretofore not available in the public domain. Please understand that it is still "under construction" and that I have only added a minimum of information there thus far. Much more will be available in the weeks and months ahead and it will be the best place to learn the eventual outcome of the DNA Analysis once we are in receipt of it.

I wish I could say that I have not encountered any hostility and animosity these past few weeks but it has been a sad revelation to me to have encountered such strong opposition and others willingness to NOT cooperate.

Be that as it may, I TOTALLY understand WHY my grandmother choose to just walk away ...
WHO NEEDS IT!

In any case, I sincere do want to Thank you ALL who have elected to make this journey with us and without prejudice and keeping an open mind... all should be solved in the next few weeks...
and then I will share the REAL details!!!
Debrina Woods
 
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